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S2E5 - Cancel Culture

Episode Description:

Cancel Culture: What is it? Is it a good thing? Bad? Did what Gina Carano posted on her social media platforms warrant her removal from the Mandalorian? These are some of the questions I ask myself in this episode. Follow me on social media and let me know your thoughts.


Disclaimer:

Some parts of the transcript may be edited for better readability, but the content remains the same. Mostly removed duplicate words, vocal filler words, and added/removed some words for clarification.


Transcript:

Hey, everyone! This is Meliza, and I'm the Talkative Introvert.


0:12

We're going to start off by saying that I am a big fan of the Mandalorian. I think Jon Favreau is doing an amazing job with the show. And I honestly wish he did the movies. It's always awesome when you're an actual fan working on something like this. I was watching the behind the scenes for the Mandalorian. And they basically made sure that the writers and people who worked on the episodes were actual fans of Star Wars, which is absolutely awesome. I think that's why the show is doing so well. Anyways, in case you couldn't tell by the title of the episode, and for me talking about the Mandalorian, I wanted to talk about cancel culture. Because of the recently canceled Gina Carano. So first of all, what is cancel culture. In case you don't know what it is, I looked up the definition on Urban Dictionary, I paraphrased it a bit. So, if you want to see all the different definitions, just go check out Urban Dictionary, or literally just search up cancel culture. There's all kinds of articles and different definitions, but they're all basically the same. It's just you know, different ways to write it. But what I got is that 'Cancel culture is a modern internet phenomenon where a person is ejected from influence, or fame by questionable actions. It's caused by a critical mass of people, and is commonly caused by an accusation whether the accusation has merit or not.'


1:36

So, in Gina Carano's case, due to some tweets I will share later, #fireginacarano are trending like crazy. And now she has been fired from Disney and will no longer be on the Mandalorian. Which really sucks because I really liked that character. It was so nice to see a strong, independent, tough, badass female character on the show. I'm sure she became a role model for a lot of little girls. And it's very unfortunate to find out that that character will no longer be in the show. I'll probably still watch it though not gonna lie. But it just kind of sucks that she won't be in it anymore. But back to cancel culture. There's definitely some good, but definitely some bad with cancel culture. If you're well versed in the internet world, I'm sure you've heard of celebrities getting canceled over voicing their opinions on social media or in interviews or even from super old tweet. So like I said, there's definitely some good with cancel culture. I think one of the greatest things about it is the fact that shows how much people can achieve if they work together. And that sounds really corny, but I've said this multiple times in previous episodes, when you don't like something, there's a good chance there's a group of people who feel the same way. And when you get those like-minded individuals together, you can achieve things that may seem impossible by yourself. It's how people were able to convince the government to end slavery, to allow colored people to vote, to allow women to vote, to allow women to own property, and allow all kinds of rights and privileges that we now have that our ancestors didn't have. However, the problem with cancel culture in this day and age though, is that it's usually not being utilized for stuff like civil rights and, you know, more important matters. It's usually canceling a celebrity or youtuber or some influencer for something they said, or something they posted for something they did, I don't know. But a lot of times, you may have noticed that people also were getting canceled for something they said like 10 years ago. Those are the ones that irked me the most, because I don't think it's fair to judge someone by who they were a decade ago. I am definitely not the same person I was 10 years ago. There's a lot of things that I changed about myself and the opinions that I've had. Because sometimes it takes real life experiences to truly understand some things. You know, for example, I know an older gentleman who grew up in the Midwest, back in the day when segregation was still a thing. He was taught to discriminate against colored people. And that was completely normal back then. He wasn't born a racist. It was just all he knew. That way of life was what was taught to me at a young age. And when he got a little older though, a black man risked his life to save his. And it really changed his perspective and made him realize that what he was taught was wrong and that people should be judged by their character not by the color of their skin. And this can be applied to some religious folks too. People who are trying to cancel this one youtuber because of some homophobic statement he made years ago. However, at the time, that was what he knew. He was very involved in his church. And that was how he was raised. And that was what he was taught. It wasn't until he got older that he realized that was wrong. Sometimes people don't know what's right or wrong until they've experienced life. You know, people just know what they were taught and how they were raised. So, to judge someone based on something they said over 10 years ago, doesn't seem right in my opinion. People change. People are allowed to make mistakes. Cancel culture, however, doesn't leave people room to grow and re-evaluate their life. And along with that, who's to even say, who's right or wrong? A difference in opinions doesn't necessarily mean there's a wrong or right side. It just means they're different. And what kind of life is that? Or what kind of society is that, that they're not allowing people to grow and learn from their mistakes? Because they're just so quick to just cancel someone. And then also, sometimes people are just so sensitive. I think I've said this a lot. I don't know on the podcast, but in real life, I say it a lot. People are so sensitive. There are some absolutely ridiculous things people use as excuses to cancel people. And sometimes people just can't take a joke.


6:07

There was this one YouTuber or influencer or whatever you want to call them. But he was getting backlash from watering his grass and making a video of himself dancing in the water from the hose. And people were accusing him of being wasteful. And I'm just like, Are you serious? He's literally watering his grass. And just having fun with it, taking advantage of such a boring task and making it fun, and then posting a video about it. And that's why I hate social media. People seriously need to get over themselves. Like, he's not hurting anyone. He's not doing anything bad. He's not saying anything bad. He's literally just dancing while watering his grass. Like, is it really a crime to water your grass? Come on. Cancel culture, it can be great and achieve amazing things, if done right. But it can also be absolutely vile and terrible and destructive, and just downright awful. So in Gina's case, why is she being canceled? So if you don't know yet, there's a slew of tweets that she's been posting. And I guess Disney has been trying to fire her apparently. I don't know how credible that information is. But that's just what I've read and heard. And so, there's some of these tweets that she sent out or posted and it eventually just snowballed. And there's the one final tweet that just basically was the straw on the camel's back, that broke the camel's back, sorry. And then now she's fired. So, I'll go through the most popular tweets, the ones that people are sharing, that led to her getting fired. I'm not going to go through her entire Twitter page. I don't even have Twitter. So, I would have to sign up, I think. Or I don't know if you can just look at people's tweets even if you don't have an account. Either way, I'm just going to go through the most popular ones. So, here's the first one. She tweeted, 'We need to clean up the election process so we are not left feeling the way we do today. Put laws in place that protect us against voter fraud. Investigate every state. Film the counting. Flush out the fake votes. Require ID. Make Voter Fraud end in 2020. Fix the system.' Okay, first of all, what's so wrong with saying that? Whether you believe there was voter fraud during the 2020 election or not, what's so wrong with asking the government to keep themselves accountable, and their employees accountable? What's the big deal? You know, in case you haven't noticed, the government makes mistakes all the time. And they're also very vulnerable and susceptible to cyber-attacks and whatnot. For example, just last year, an article came out where employees were fired from EDD for fraudulent and unemployment claims. So if you don't know what EDD is, it's the Employment Development Department in California. And they're responsible for processing the unemployment cheques. Last year, because of the pandemic, people were getting extra money. I think it was like an extra $600 on top of what they're already getting. And of course, people wanted in on that. A more recent article just came out in January. So, I'll link that. But it basically states that 9.7% of the claims since the start of the pandemic, were fraudulent. If people were able to do that, and get, you know, the extra 600 bucks plus whatever unemployment gives you, then why wouldn't they be able to commit voter fraud. It's completely plausible, right? So, I don't see the harm of her just saying that. Like, it's okay to make sure that there's no voter fraud. What's so wrong about that? I was so confused by this tweet. I just didn't understand what's so wrong to make sure that we have the right votes and that the right votes are accounted for? Isn't that the whole point of democracy is to make sure that whoever the majority votes for wins?


10:32

So, I thought that was weird why people were like, so angry about. Calm down people. It's okay. It's okay to ask people to be accountable. In fact, we should promote that. Because the government does make mistakes quite often. Okay, next tweet. 'They’re mad cuz I won’t put pronouns in my bio to show my support for trans lives. After months of harassing me in every way. I decided to put 3 VERY controversial words in my bio.. beep/bop/boop I’m not against trans lives at all. In a separate tweet, she said, 'Beep/bop/boop has zero to do with mocking trans people and 100% to do with exposing the bullying mentality of the mob that has taken over the voices of many genuine causes. I want people to know you can take it with a smile. So boop you for misunderstanding, #alllovenohate.' Then she deleted that offer profile after her co-star Pedro Pascal, who plays the Mandalorian explained why people are adding pronouns to their profiles. And she responded with 'I didn't know before but I do now. I won't be putting them in my bio, but good for all you who choose to. I stand against bullying, especially the most vulnerable and freedom to choose.' Okay. Before I get to my opinion of this tweet, I want to first of all say I absolutely have nothing against the trans community, the LGBTQ+ community or any community, where you get to be your true authentic self. I fully support whatever people want to identify as. And I will call you by whatever pronouns you would like. Although it is very hard for me to say they or them. Because you know, plural. We honestly should just create a new non-binary pronoun. This one person goes by Fae and Faer. Hopefully I'm pronouncing that right. I thought that was nice. Why not give yourselves your own pronoun, right? I'm sure that would be so empowering to see that in the dictionary. Fae/Faer definition: pronoun, used for humans who do not identify with any gender. I can't speak for non-binary people but I bet seeing that in a dictionary and have it be solidified in history forever, must be empowering. That's why I like Tagalog. Because there's no pronouns and words aren't gendered. For example, the word for child is 'Anak'. And that's it. There's no term for son or daughter. You have to specify if it's a female child, or a male child, which is like an extra word on top of a neck. But like words for cousin or words for sibling or words for... like, just different words don't have a gender, it's just what it is. And then if you want to know whether they're female or male, you ask are they female or male? And then, you know, you respond. So anyways, back to Gina. I understand what she's trying to say. But also understand how it can be construed as transphobic. In my opinion, I think her fight wasn't what the trans community, but rather with the social media empires and from the people forcing her to be a certain way and to express herself in a certain way on social media, especially because she's a public figure. I think she just didn't want to conform to how the media wanted her to be. And I'm totally all for that. I'm assuming she probably would have acted the same way if it were to be a different subject. It was just that this specific event, so happened to deal with the trans community. If it was a different subject, and she was again being forced to do something she doesn't normally do out of character or whatever, she probably would have acted the same way. For me personally, I don't put pronouns on my bio. But that has nothing to do with my beliefs and how I feel about the community. I don't do it because I just don't do anything with my bio. It would be very out of character for me to even give a rat's ass about my bio. For this episode, I actually had to go back and even see what I wrote on my Insta bio because I haven't changed it in so long. It has probably been the same since the beginning. I may be changed it a couple times before, but it literally says photos and then there's a camera emoji. That's it. Then I had to go reading my podcasts one, and all it says is 'A podcast hosted by a talkative introvert'. And that's it. That's all I put. And I don't ever put anything on there. And I understand the frustration of someone may be nagging you or criticizing you or constantly telling you to change how you do something and change how you want to perceive yourself through your social media platform.


15:28

So, I understand. Like, I would get frustrated too, if someone was constantly trying to force me to change who I am on social media. For Gina, maybe it was just the wording. She did say that she has nothing against them and doesn't condone bullying, but maybe she should have explained a little more why she was so opposed to doing that. I feel like there's a message behind those actions worth sharing with our fans. That's kind of the problem with tweets and other posts. They're just so short, you usually don't write a novel explaining your thought process. Then by the time you sent a response to clarify your posts, the news and all the journalists are already all over it. And journalists can write an article within hours and send it out to the public for everyone to read and digest. So, it doesn't give you the time to step back and see, you know, is this tweet offensive? Am I going to hurt a large community? And maybe should I edit this or clarify or something, you know? Then there's the final tweet. And I believe this is the actual tweet that got her fired, from my understanding, like searching through all this stuff. And this one is a doozy. Okay, so it goes, 'Jews were beaten in the streets, not by Nazi soldiers but by their neighbors…even by children. Because history is edited, most people today don’t realize that to get to the point where Nazi soldiers could easily round up thousands of Jews, the government first made their own neighbors hate them simply for being Jews. How is that any different from hating someone for their political views?' So, this one is rough. I can totally see why people were getting offended by this one, especially those of Jewish descent. From what I read, what people were getting out of this is that she is comparing how Jews are being treated to how republicans are being treated. I think that's what she's trying to get at. Again, I don't have Twitter. I don't follow famous people. So, I don't know her personally. But that is how people interpreted this specific post. And that's what really, you know, really fired up the #ginacarano. Because I think that hashtag has been around for a while. But I think this one just really, really got them. Really got the people. So obviously, Republicans are not being sent to the concentration camps, and they're not forced to wear something like the Star of David. They're not, you know, being killed and rounded up and killed. And we obviously are nowhere close to being in the realm of the holocaust. With that said, I think I know what she's trying to say. And hear me out. You obviously don't have to agree with me. But just hear me out for a second. I want to explain what I got out of it. And what I think she's trying to say.


18:36

I think it's safe to say that Republicans and Democrats do not see eye-to-eye. And they can also be very vocal, and sometimes very physical about it. I can't speak for how it was before because I was young and didn't care before. And you know, the time before me. But it seems really, really bad now. Like it just seems so, so, so, so bad. And I don't know if that's because of the advancement of technology, and the internet and people, you know, being more outspoken on the internet. Like I don't know why it's so bad now, or if it was always like this, and I just never noticed. I don't know. It seems just awful, though. Because people are absolutely awful to each other. People are bashing on each other on social media. People are unfriending each other on social media and in real life. People have stopped talking to each other. People also get violent as we've seen on the news. I mentioned this on a previous episode. But there are people who have literally known each other their whole lives. Or friends or our family members who have completely just ended their relationship because of their political differences. Even if they didn't even know they had political differences until last year, they just completely ended the relationship just like that, in the blink of an eye. Well, not in a blink of an eye. But you know. And I think what Gina was trying to get at is that the Holocaust didn't happen overnight. It was gradual. You basically had Group A convince Group B to hate group C. So, in the terms of the Holocaust, you know, you got the government convincing non-Jews to hate Jews. You know government group A convincing non-Jews Group B to hate Jews group C. And this doesn't pertain to just the Holocaust. You can find this formula, throughout history and all over the world. It's a very simple concept. You divide and conquer. It just takes a very charismatic leader and a big enough group of followers to get to the point of the Holocaust. And I think that's what she was trying to get at is that, you know, the hate that Republicans are getting, which I know democrats get hate too, but in her terms, or in the terms of this tweet, you know, Republicans get a really bad rap. Especially in California. I don't know what it's like in the rest of the world, or the rest of the United States. But in California, because we're such a blue state, I see it all the time. And I hear all the time. And I hear people refer to Republicans as racists and fascists and a really privileged, rich people and blah, blah, blah, even though not all republicans are white, not all republicans are rich, not all Republicans are racist, or fascist or whatever. But in California, for some reason, Republicans are compared to Nazis. Which, in my opinion or in my experience, sorry. In my experience with Republicans that I know personally, they're far from that. They're nowhere close to being a Nazi. They would never be seen, you know, hauling people away and killing them, just because of their religious affiliation. But I don't know why in California it's like that. I guess it's just because we're a blue state, I don't know. But we also have a lot of high-profile people here. Like we have a lot of celebrities who live here, we have a lot of influencers, we have a lot of people who are public facing and have a large following. Because it's California, you know, we are Hollywood and whatever. And so, you hear about it a lot on people's podcasts, on their YouTube channels, on their whatever they do. They're very adamant about their hatred towards Republicans. And I hear all the time in the podcasts that I listen to, and the stuff that I watch. And it is definitely toxic. Like I had to take a break from listening to that stuff, or listening to California based podcasts and YouTube channels, and whatever. Because they were just so adamant about their hatred towards republicans in it, it breaks my heart because I have family and I have friends on both sides.


23:29

And they would never do something as bad as a Nazi person or as bad as killing someone or hurting someone over their political beliefs. And it's just hard to hear. Because when they say negative things about a group of people, they're referring to my friends and family who are in that group. And they would never hurt someone like that. So, I get what she's trying to say. I don't know, again, like I said, on the house, like for the rest of America, but I know in California, they do bash on republicans a lot, because we are such a blue state. And they say things that are just downright awful. And in my opinion, it's just wrong, because they're again, stereotyping a group of people. And they're basically saying that that group of people, that all the individuals in that community are all the same. And that's, in my opinion, just as bad as judging someone on their ethnicity and their religion and their whatever, right? Isn't that what racism is? And isn't that what's with the different communities and what we're trying to fight against is to show people that everyone is not the same and that they're not all bad people, but yet it's okay to do that to Republicans. So, I kind of get what she was saying there. Maybe she shouldn't have used the Holocaust as an example? Or maybe We should have clarified it more? I don't know, like, I don't know how to make that post a little better, or help people understand. But I do understand what you're trying to get at and how it really just comes down to just people hating people. And when that happens, it can lead to something like the Holocaust. I'm not saying that the fight between Democrats and Republicans will get to that point. But I also can't say that it's not impossible, you know? I'm sure Jewish people didn't think there will be concentration camps and didn't think they were going to be killed over their own religion, you know? So it's not impossible, but I don't think it will happen in our lifetime, at least I hope not. And I hope it will never happen. But people really do take this political stuff very, very seriously. And it really is not healthy to have so much hate between two groups of people. I'm honestly scared that it's just going to get worse every four years. And I guess all we can do is just wait and see and hope people realize that, you know, they're just differences. Everyone has differences in beliefs. Everyone has differences in their thought process and their opinions. And, you know, one group just thinks that their beliefs is what will be the best for the country, you know? That's the thing is that, yeah, they have differences in political beliefs. But both sides, honestly believe that whatever they think, is what's best for the country. And that's the hardest part, because no one truly knows what's best for such a large group of people. You know, like, if our country was smaller, it might have been a little easier. But we have so many people in America. How are you supposed to appeal to everybody? How are you supposed to fulfill the needs of all these people with different backgrounds and different socio-economic levels and different everything, you know? So, I don't know. I get what you're saying with this tweet. And I get why she said it, because there is a lot of hate in this country, especially during the election. I just think maybe she should have clarified it more. And that goes back to my point that these posts and these tweets, these social media posts are always so short, there's not really a lot of room. I think tweets, right, have a character limit? It's hard to get your point across if you're just limited to a few sentences or like an image or something, you know. And a lot of times, if you're going to post something long, people probably won't read it anyways. So, to get your point across in a short, few sentences doesn't always work out.


23:54

So, I wanted to clarify that this episode isn't to defend Gina Carano. I don't know her personally. I will never vouch for someone or defend someone I don't actually know. I just wanted to point out what cancel culture is. And I'm really just solely judging her on these tweets that I read. I don't follow her. So, I don't know what else she's written. So, my opinion is solely just based on these that I have read that I've taken from articles. These are the most popular tweets. So if she says something worse, I don't know about it. I don't know what she said. If there is, you know, something worth canceling her over, I don't know. But basically, I did this episode, because I think people need to slow down. The internet is so fast, it's impossible to keep up. It doesn't allow people to take a step back and fully evaluate the situation. It doesn't allow people to gather all the right information, because the media is there to just tell you how you should feel. And the problem with that is that the media doesn't care what's right or what's wrong. They don't necessarily care about gathering all the information, all the necessary information. All they care about is money. They're very money centric, and only care about you clicking their articles and creating foot traffic for their sites. And people just eat that stuff up. Because people love a good scandal. People love gossip. I mean, that's why TMZ and People magazine and all these different magazines do so well. Because people eat that stuff up. They want to see a controversy. They want to see all this drama. It's exciting, you know? It's better someone else than them, right? It's better that they read about someone else, then it actually happens to their own life. So, I think in a way, it's people living vicariously through celebrities without having to actually deal with the impact. So in my opinion, should she had been fired from Disney? If she violated any company policies, then yeah. She should have been fired. She should be subjected to the same policies just as any other employee. If her contract though, doesn't clearly say that she can't post certain types of tweets or social media posts and it's not clearly defined exactly like, what she's not allowed to do, then no. She shouldn't be fired. It's all down to the contract. What was in her contract? Did she violate anything? If she did, then fire her. If she didn't, then I don't think it warrants being fired from Disney. And that's a very practical, very rational way. It's black and white. But when it comes to employment, it kind of is black and white, you know? I don't know. I don't know if that makes sense. As far as being canceled, I don't know. I don't think so. Because to cancel her is basically saying that people are not allowed to voice their opinions on their own personal social media platforms. And you have to also think, when does it make sense to separate the art from the artists? There are so many famous people who openly talk about their drug use, the violent acts they've committed, crimes they've committed, and so on. But people idolize them. And they spend hundreds, sometimes thousands of dollars to either buy their merch, buy tickets to see them, buy their products, buy their movies, buy whatever. And you're telling me they're not worth canceling? But it's okay to cancel someone over some tweets? Come on. There are worse people out there than Gina. Then you have to also ask, if Gina is being canceled over some tweets, then why are others not held to the same standards? Chris Brown. Every time someone gets canceled, I always think back, Chris Brown. Chris Brown beat Rihanna. Rihanna. I think she pronounces her name Rihanna. He didn't post some nasty tweets online about her. He didn't post something on Instagram about her. He literally, physically beat her. And there are pictures of Rihanna all bruised up from that beating. Yet not too long afterwards, you saw him being featured in songs, you see him starring in music videos, you see him attending award ceremonies and just living his life as if he didn't commit domestic abuse. Hollywood and his fans just let him peruse by as if nothing happened even though there are pictures. Even though a person got beat. Like there's bruises. I'm sure she's probably scarred for life because of that event. And he's just out there singing and dancing.


33:36

And that's totally cool. And it's totally fine. So you're telling me a strong, independent female character was removed from a very popular and beloved show. But people let an abuser walk the red carpet? Like how does that make any sense? So, if we're gonna cancel Gina because of her tweets, then you might as well just cancel everybody. That's the problem with cancel culture. Cancel culture is dangerous because there's no structure. There's no criteria. People just cancel people because other people want to cancel them. Because they said something they didn't like. But yet all these other people can just live their life normally. Like there's so many celebrities out there who are not, you know, being held accountable to their actions and not being canceled and still are making millions of dollars, even though they're terrible, horrible people. But no. Let's cancel Gina Carano for her tweets. Let's cancel all these people who said something terrible 10 years ago. Let's go cancel this guy for dancing in hose water. Like it doesn't make sense. When is it okay to cancel someone and not to cancel someone? Why does someone get canceled for do something as miniscule as that, but then the other person can get away with beating someone? Like it doesn't make any sense. Cancel culture can be so powerful. If used properly, it can be an amazing life changing tool, it can do a lot of good if people care to use it in that fashion and not worry so much about what a person says on social media. I think people forget that actions speak louder than words. And right now, based on what I've read, and what little I know about Gina, and what led her to getting fired, it was just all talk. And I didn't see her actually do anything terrible. I didn't see her beat someone. There's no evidence of her hurting someone or killing someone or assaulting someone or doing anything to that extent. So if you're going to cancel Gina, then cancel Chris Brown, cancel all these other celebrities who've probably done far worse things. You know, there are people who still love Michael Jackson, because they're able to separate the art from the artists. I mean, I don't know all the details. I never watched that one documentary. But you know, he was allegedly a pedophile. And yet he was so loved. He was the king of pop, right? The king of pop? Yeah. And people cried and mourned his death. But yet, you know, let's go try to cancel Kevin Hart for something he said 10 years ago. You know what I mean? Like, people's priorities doesn't make sense. It's like, the more popular or the more, yeah, popular. This is all a popularity contest. The more popular you are, the more untouchable you are. And I absolutely hate that about celebrities. And about people who idolize celebrities. Because celebrities at the end of the day, are still human. They're still capable of making mistakes. They were, you know, born the same way we were. They laugh just like we do, they breathe the same air. They're not gods, they're not the celestial beings. They should still be accountable for their actions. So anyways, that's the end of my rant. Just wanting to get that out. So, let me leave you with a quote Gina posted. 'If you are silent about your beliefs because you are worried someone will be offended, then your beliefs are not that important to you but rather what people think about you is. What people see about you will speak more loudly than how people feel about you, because in the end, when we stand up for what is right and true, we will have many who hate us or love us but all will know what we are fighting for.' by T. B. LaBerge. Is it LaBerg? I hope it's LaBerg. LaBerge? I don't know.


38:12

All right. If you enjoy what you hear and want to stay up to date on the show, please follow me on Facebook and/or Instagram. You can also check out my website at thetalkativeintrovertpodcast.com. All the information will be on there as well as in the show notes. Please help support the show by sharing it with your friends and family. Thanks so much and I'll talk to you guys in the next episode.


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